Islam ja isänmaa

Niin sitä ajattelin että josko uskonto "antaa luvan" hilppasta jonnekkin karkuun kun ei ole "muslimivaltio?" puolustettavana?
Ei herneitä nenään..
Matti

krap kirjoitti:

Niin sitä ajattelin että josko uskonto "antaa luvan" hilppasta jonnekkin karkuun kun ei ole "muslimivaltio?" puolustettavana?
Ei herneitä nenään..
Matti

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It is not permissible for a Muslim to fight with kaafirs against the Muslims at all

Question:
I work in the army of a non-Muslim state, and there are wars between them and the Muslims. What is the ruling if they send me with a division of this army to wage war against the Muslims? As a Muslim, my feelings are that I never want to fight against Muslims in any war.
What should I do?
What is the ruling if I go…?

Answer:

Praise be to Allaah.

If you are sent to wage war against the Muslims, then it is not permissible for you to take part at all. Helping the kaafirs against the Muslims is a form of major kufr which puts one beyond the pale of Islam. Allaah says concerning one who supports the mushrikeen (interpretation of the meaning):

“And if any amongst you takes them (as Awliyaa’, i.e., friends), then surely, he is one of them”[al-Maa’idah 5:51]

With regard to how you may get out of this situation, and what excuse you can give to get out of this dilemma if it happens, we ask Allaah to help you, and we suggest that you consult some Muslims who have relevant knowledge or experience.

We want to emphasize to you the necessity of finding other employment and of leaving service in the army of the kaafirs, because that implies helping them, strengthening them and increasing the numbers of their fighters and supporters – unless your work can bring some benefits to the Muslims, such as giving information and secrets of the kaafirs to the Muslims so as to help the Muslims, or if your work is purely da’wah, such as giving khutbahs and leading prayers for the Muslims in the kaafir army whilst also advising them to avoid any work that will strengthen the kaafirs. We ask Allaah to keep you safe from temptation and to give you a good end in this world and in the Hereafter.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
http://islamqa.com/index.php?ref=14004&ln=eng&txt=kaafir army


Kafiirimaan armeijaan voi olla sallittua liittyä, ja oppia vähän sen saloja, _vain_ jos ei ole mitään vaaraa, että joutuisi sotimaan toisia muslimeja vastaan.


Question:
What is the ruling on Muslims serving in the military of non muslim country ? What is the evidence for its permissibility or prohibition?
And lastly, what is the status of a Muslim working to help those in the military to fulfill their obligations to Allaah while serving in the Army, Navy, or whatever?

Answer:

Praise be to Allaah.

We put this question to Shaykh Muhammad ibn Saalih al-‘Uthaymeen, may Allaah preserve him, who answered as follows:

“Praise be to Allaah, the Lord of the Worlds. Military matters are problematic, because they involve helping these kuffaar to wage war against the Muslims or those who have entered into a treaty with the Muslims. If no such thing is involved, it may be advantageous for Muslims to work in these armies so as to learn their secrets and be aware of their potential evil. In other words, if working in these armies could be of benefit, it may be permissible, otherwise it is not allowed.”

On this basis, if a person works as a preacher or daa’iyah or imaam or muezzin, serving the Muslims and calling non-Muslims to Islam, then there is nothing wrong with this.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
http://islamqa.com/index.php?ref=3885&ln=eng&txt=kaafir military

Jake "Kafir" Waits kirjoitti:

    14004     [Print] [Send To Friend ] [Main ]    
It is not permissible for a Muslim to fight with kaafirs against the Muslims at all

Question:
I work in the army of a non-Muslim state, and there are wars between them and the Muslims. What is the ruling if they send me with a division of this army to wage war against the Muslims? As a Muslim, my feelings are that I never want to fight against Muslims in any war.
What should I do?
What is the ruling if I go…?

Answer:

Praise be to Allaah.

If you are sent to wage war against the Muslims, then it is not permissible for you to take part at all. Helping the kaafirs against the Muslims is a form of major kufr which puts one beyond the pale of Islam. Allaah says concerning one who supports the mushrikeen (interpretation of the meaning):

“And if any amongst you takes them (as Awliyaa’, i.e., friends), then surely, he is one of them”[al-Maa’idah 5:51]

With regard to how you may get out of this situation, and what excuse you can give to get out of this dilemma if it happens, we ask Allaah to help you, and we suggest that you consult some Muslims who have relevant knowledge or experience.

We want to emphasize to you the necessity of finding other employment and of leaving service in the army of the kaafirs, because that implies helping them, strengthening them and increasing the numbers of their fighters and supporters – unless your work can bring some benefits to the Muslims, such as giving information and secrets of the kaafirs to the Muslims so as to help the Muslims, or if your work is purely da’wah, such as giving khutbahs and leading prayers for the Muslims in the kaafir army whilst also advising them to avoid any work that will strengthen the kaafirs. We ask Allaah to keep you safe from temptation and to give you a good end in this world and in the Hereafter.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
http://islamqa.com/index.php?ref=14004&ln=eng&txt=kaafir army


Kafiirimaan armeijaan voi olla sallittua liittyä, ja oppia vähän sen saloja, _vain_ jos ei ole mitään vaaraa, että joutuisi sotimaan toisia muslimeja vastaan.


Question:
What is the ruling on Muslims serving in the military of non muslim country ? What is the evidence for its permissibility or prohibition?
And lastly, what is the status of a Muslim working to help those in the military to fulfill their obligations to Allaah while serving in the Army, Navy, or whatever?

Answer:

Praise be to Allaah.

We put this question to Shaykh Muhammad ibn Saalih al-‘Uthaymeen, may Allaah preserve him, who answered as follows:

“Praise be to Allaah, the Lord of the Worlds. Military matters are problematic, because they involve helping these kuffaar to wage war against the Muslims or those who have entered into a treaty with the Muslims. If no such thing is involved, it may be advantageous for Muslims to work in these armies so as to learn their secrets and be aware of their potential evil. In other words, if working in these armies could be of benefit, it may be permissible, otherwise it is not allowed.”

On this basis, if a person works as a preacher or daa’iyah or imaam or muezzin, serving the Muslims and calling non-Muslims to Islam, then there is nothing wrong with this.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
http://islamqa.com/index.php?ref=3885&ln=eng&txt=kaafir military

Olisi mukava jos joku Suomessa syntynyt muslimi voisi ottaa tähän kantaa?
Liekö tämä väärä foorumi kysellä heidän mielipiteitään?
Matti

krap kirjoitti:

Olisi mukava jos joku Suomessa syntynyt muslimi voisi ottaa tähän kantaa?
Liekö tämä väärä foorumi kysellä heidän mielipiteitään?
Matti

Ei täällä kovin hyvin kysymyksiin vastauksia muslimeilta saa, ainakaan sellaisiin kysymyksiin, jotka paljastaisivat islamin todellisen luonteen.

Ei ne nyt sentään niin tyhmiä ole.
Siksi on hyvä lukea vähän muualtakin, mitä ne puuhaavat ja eri toten, mitä islamin mukaan on tehtävä.

Se on yksinkertaisinta. Jos islam käskee tekemään jotain, muslimi tekee niin ja se joka ei tee niin, ei ole muslimi. Miten muutenkaan se voisi olla.

Varmasti itseään muslimiksi kutsuvia on hyvin paljon erilaisia, ja siis hyvin äkkiä saatkin hyvin paljon erilaisia vastauksia. Miksi et siis ottaisi selvää siitä, mikä on islamin opillinen näkemys asiassa.

Jake "Kafir" Waits kirjoitti:

Ei täällä kovin hyvin kysymyksiin vastauksia muslimeilta saa, ainakaan sellaisiin kysymyksiin, jotka paljastaisivat islamin todellisen luonteen.

Ei ne nyt sentään niin tyhmiä ole.
Siksi on hyvä lukea vähän muualtakin, mitä ne puuhaavat ja eri toten, mitä islamin mukaan on tehtävä.

Se on yksinkertaisinta. Jos islam käskee tekemään jotain, muslimi tekee niin ja se joka ei tee niin, ei ole muslimi. Miten muutenkaan se voisi olla.

Varmasti itseään muslimiksi kutsuvia on hyvin paljon erilaisia, ja siis hyvin äkkiä saatkin hyvin paljon erilaisia vastauksia. Miksi et siis ottaisi selvää siitä, mikä on islamin opillinen näkemys asiassa.

Niinkään valmiiksi kirjoitettuja öö ohjeita vaan ihmisten tuntoja (muslimien)
Ehkä tämä on väärä foorumi. Sorry
Matti
Ps. Yrittänyt keskustella aiheesta täällä tampereella muslimien kanssa..suuttuvat..?

Ennenkuin tämä thread menee juupas-eipäs-joo-joo
väittelyksi haluan kiittää kaikkia mielipiteistä.
Asia käsitelty.
Matti

Tässä yhden muslimin ajatuksia:

http://www.mil.fi/ruotuvaki/index.dsp?action=read_page&pid=61&aid=939