General Rebuttal to the Theory of evolution

Tieteellisiä todisteita on ainoastaan vertaisarvioiduissa ja julkaistuissa tutkimusraporteissa. Näytäpä linkit niihin, jotka muka noin osoittavat.

Ennustan, ettet näytä ja tuskin vastaatkaan.

tieteenharrastaja kirjoitti:

Tieteellisiä todisteita on ainoastaan vertaisarvioiduissa ja julkaistuissa tutkimusraporteissa. Näytäpä linkit niihin, jotka muka noin osoittavat.

Ennustan, ettet näytä ja tuskin vastaatkaan.

Lue lisää

Fagerstrom, T. P. Jagers, P. Schuster, and E. Szathmary. 1996. Biologists put on mathematical glasses. Science 274: 2039-2040.
Prothero, D.R. 1992. Punctuated Equilibrium At Twenty: A Paleontological Perspective. Skeptic 1: 38-47.
Stanley, S.M. 1992. The empirical case for the punctuational model of evolution, in The Dynamics of Evolution. A. Somit and S.A. Peterson (ed.). Ithaca, New York: Cornell University Press. pp. 85-102.
Cheetham, A.H. 1986. Tempo of evolution in a Neogene bryozoan: rates of morphologic change within and across species boundaries. Paleobiology, 12: 190-202.
Stanley, S.M. and X. Yang. 1987. Approximate evolutionary stasis for bivalve morphology over millions of years: a multivariate, multilineage study. Paleobiology, 13: 113-139.
Williamson, P.G. 1981. Paleontological documentation of speciation of Cenozoic mollusks from the Turkana Basin." Nature, 293: 437-443.
Williamson, P.G. 1985. Punctuated equilibrium, morphological stasis, and the paleontological documentation of speciation. Biological Journal of the Linnean Society of London, 26: 307-324.
Barnosky, A.D. 1987. Punctuated equilibrium and phyletic gradualism, some facts from the Quaternary mammal record. Current Mammalogy, 1: 109-147.
Prothero, D.R. and N. Shubin. 1983. "Tempo and mode of speciation in Oligocene mammals." Geological Society of America, Abstracts with Programs, 16(6): 665.
Prothero, D.R. 1992. "Evolutionary patterns at the terrestrial Eocene-Oligocene boundary in North America." Fifth North American Paleontological Convention, Abstracts and Programs, Paleontological Society Special Publication 6: 238.
Prothero, D.R. and W.A. Berggren (eds.). 1992. Eocene-Oligocene Climactic and Biotic Evolution. Princeton: Princeton University Press.
Prothero, D.R., T. Heaton, and S.M. Stanley. (In press). "Patterns of evolution in mammals at the Eocene-Oligocene climactic crisis." Paleobiology.
Donovan, S.K. and C.R.C. Paul, eds. 1998. The Adequacy of the Fossil Record. Wiley, Chichester, UK.
Richard A. Kerr. 1997. Does Evolutionary History Take Million-Year Breaks? Science 278: 576.
Dennis Normile. 1998. MAMMALIAN EVOLUTION MEETING: New views of the origins of mammals. Science 281: 775.
S.J. Gould and N. Eldredge. 1994. Nature 368:407.
Chen, J.Y., J. Dzik, G.D. Edgecombe, L. Ramskold, G.Q. Zhou. 1995. A possible early Cambrian chordate. Nature 377: 720-722.
Kerr, R.A. 1993. Evolution's big bang gets even more explosive. Science 261: 1274-1275.
Bowring, S.A., J.P. Grotzinger, C.E. Isachsen, A.H. Knoll, S.M. Pelechaty, and P. Kolosov. 1993. Calibrating rates of early Cambrian evolution. Science 261: 1293-1298.
Gould, S.J. 1995. Of it, not above it. Nature 377: 681-682.
Jablonski, D. 1999. The Future of the Fossil Record. Science 284: 2114-2116.
Fortey, R. 2001. The Cambrian Explosion Exploded? Science 293: 438-439.
Morell, V. 1999. Size Matters: The Genes Behind Adaptation. Science 284: 2106-2108.
Soul�, M.E. and L.S. Mills. 1998. No need to isolate genetics. Science 282: 1658.
Wetermeirer, R.L., J.D. Brawn, S.A. Simpson, T.L. Esker, R.W. Jansen, J.W. Walk, E.L. Kershner, J.L. Bouzat, and K.N. Paige. 1998. Tracking the long-term decline and recovery of an isolated population. Science 282: 1695.
Armbruster, P. and D.H. Reed. 2005. Inbreeding depression in benign and stressful environments. Heredity 95: 235�242.
Wolf Spider
Reed, D.H., A.C. Nicholas and G.E. Stratton. 2006. Inbreeding levels and prey abundance interact to determine fecundity in natural populations of two species of wolf spider. Conserv. Genet. doi:10.1007/s10592-006-9260-4.
Cole, B.J. and D.C. Wiernasz. 1999. The Selective Advantage of Low Relatedness. Science 285: 891-893.
Sharp, P.M. 1997. In search of molecular Darwinism. Nature 385: 111-112.
Shapiro JA. 1992. Genetica 86: 99-111.
Pennisi, E. 1999. Gaining New Insight Into the Molecular Basis of Evolution. Science 285: 654-655.
Behe M.J. 1990. Histone deletion mutants challenge the molecular clock hypothesis. Trends in Biochemical Sciences 15 (10): 374-376.
Huelsenbeck, J.P. and B. Rannala. 1997. Phylogenetic methods come of age: testing hypotheses in an evolutionary context. Science 276: 227-232.

Voe, voe. kirjoitti:

Fagerstrom, T. P. Jagers, P. Schuster, and E. Szathmary. 1996. Biologists put on mathematical glasses. Science 274: 2039-2040.
Prothero, D.R. 1992. Punctuated Equilibrium At Twenty: A Paleontological Perspective. Skeptic 1: 38-47.
Stanley, S.M. 1992. The empirical case for the punctuational model of evolution, in The Dynamics of Evolution. A. Somit and S.A. Peterson (ed.). Ithaca, New York: Cornell University Press. pp. 85-102.
Cheetham, A.H. 1986. Tempo of evolution in a Neogene bryozoan: rates of morphologic change within and across species boundaries. Paleobiology, 12: 190-202.
Stanley, S.M. and X. Yang. 1987. Approximate evolutionary stasis for bivalve morphology over millions of years: a multivariate, multilineage study. Paleobiology, 13: 113-139.
Williamson, P.G. 1981. Paleontological documentation of speciation of Cenozoic mollusks from the Turkana Basin." Nature, 293: 437-443.
Williamson, P.G. 1985. Punctuated equilibrium, morphological stasis, and the paleontological documentation of speciation. Biological Journal of the Linnean Society of London, 26: 307-324.
Barnosky, A.D. 1987. Punctuated equilibrium and phyletic gradualism, some facts from the Quaternary mammal record. Current Mammalogy, 1: 109-147.
Prothero, D.R. and N. Shubin. 1983. "Tempo and mode of speciation in Oligocene mammals." Geological Society of America, Abstracts with Programs, 16(6): 665.
Prothero, D.R. 1992. "Evolutionary patterns at the terrestrial Eocene-Oligocene boundary in North America." Fifth North American Paleontological Convention, Abstracts and Programs, Paleontological Society Special Publication 6: 238.
Prothero, D.R. and W.A. Berggren (eds.). 1992. Eocene-Oligocene Climactic and Biotic Evolution. Princeton: Princeton University Press.
Prothero, D.R., T. Heaton, and S.M. Stanley. (In press). "Patterns of evolution in mammals at the Eocene-Oligocene climactic crisis." Paleobiology.
Donovan, S.K. and C.R.C. Paul, eds. 1998. The Adequacy of the Fossil Record. Wiley, Chichester, UK.
Richard A. Kerr. 1997. Does Evolutionary History Take Million-Year Breaks? Science 278: 576.
Dennis Normile. 1998. MAMMALIAN EVOLUTION MEETING: New views of the origins of mammals. Science 281: 775.
S.J. Gould and N. Eldredge. 1994. Nature 368:407.
Chen, J.Y., J. Dzik, G.D. Edgecombe, L. Ramskold, G.Q. Zhou. 1995. A possible early Cambrian chordate. Nature 377: 720-722.
Kerr, R.A. 1993. Evolution's big bang gets even more explosive. Science 261: 1274-1275.
Bowring, S.A., J.P. Grotzinger, C.E. Isachsen, A.H. Knoll, S.M. Pelechaty, and P. Kolosov. 1993. Calibrating rates of early Cambrian evolution. Science 261: 1293-1298.
Gould, S.J. 1995. Of it, not above it. Nature 377: 681-682.
Jablonski, D. 1999. The Future of the Fossil Record. Science 284: 2114-2116.
Fortey, R. 2001. The Cambrian Explosion Exploded? Science 293: 438-439.
Morell, V. 1999. Size Matters: The Genes Behind Adaptation. Science 284: 2106-2108.
Soul�, M.E. and L.S. Mills. 1998. No need to isolate genetics. Science 282: 1658.
Wetermeirer, R.L., J.D. Brawn, S.A. Simpson, T.L. Esker, R.W. Jansen, J.W. Walk, E.L. Kershner, J.L. Bouzat, and K.N. Paige. 1998. Tracking the long-term decline and recovery of an isolated population. Science 282: 1695.
Armbruster, P. and D.H. Reed. 2005. Inbreeding depression in benign and stressful environments. Heredity 95: 235�242.
Wolf Spider
Reed, D.H., A.C. Nicholas and G.E. Stratton. 2006. Inbreeding levels and prey abundance interact to determine fecundity in natural populations of two species of wolf spider. Conserv. Genet. doi:10.1007/s10592-006-9260-4.
Cole, B.J. and D.C. Wiernasz. 1999. The Selective Advantage of Low Relatedness. Science 285: 891-893.
Sharp, P.M. 1997. In search of molecular Darwinism. Nature 385: 111-112.
Shapiro JA. 1992. Genetica 86: 99-111.
Pennisi, E. 1999. Gaining New Insight Into the Molecular Basis of Evolution. Science 285: 654-655.
Behe M.J. 1990. Histone deletion mutants challenge the molecular clock hypothesis. Trends in Biochemical Sciences 15 (10): 374-376.
Huelsenbeck, J.P. and B. Rannala. 1997. Phylogenetic methods come of age: testing hypotheses in an evolutionary context. Science 276: 227-232.

Lue lisää

Felsenstein, J. 1981. J. Mol. Evol. 17: 368.
Goldman, N. 1993. J. Mol. Evol. 36:182.
Yang, Z., N. Goldman, and A. Friday. 1995. Mol. Biol. Evol. 11: 316.
Yang, Z. 1996. J. Mol. Evol. 42: 587.
Yang, Z. and D. Roberts. 1995. Mol. Biol. Evol. 12: 451.
Huelsenbeck, J.P., D.M. Hillis, and R. Nielsen. 1996. Syst. Biol. 45: 546.
Huelsenbeck, J.P. and J.J. Bull. 1996. Syst. Biol. 45: 92.
Huelsenbeck, J.P., B. Rannala, and Z. Yang. 1997. Evolution. 51:410.
Pennisi, E. 1999. Is It Time to Uproot the Tree of Life? Science 284: 1305-1307.
R.L. Cann, M. Stoneking, A.C. Wilson. 1987. Mitochondrial DNA and human evolution. Nature 325: 31.
L. Vigilant, M. Stoneking, A.C. Harpending, K. Hawkes, A.C. Wilson. 1991. African populations and the evolution of human mitochondrial DNA. Science 253: 1503.
M. Hasegawa, S. Horai. 1991. Time of the deepest root for polymorphism in human mitochondrial DNA. J. Mol. Evol. 32: 37.
Stoneking M, Sherry ST, Redd AJ, Vigilant L. 1992. New approaches to dating suggest a recent age for the human mtDNA ancestor. Philos. Trans. R. Soc. Lond. B Biol. Sci. 337: 167-175.
S. Paabo. 1995. The Y chromosome and the origin of all of us (men). Science 268: 1141.
R.L. Dorit, H. Akashi, W. Gilbert. 1995. Absence of polymorphism at the ZFY locus on the human Y chromosome. Science 268: 1183.
Hammer, M.F. 1995. A recent common ancestry for human Y chromosomes. Nature 378: 376-378.
Whitfield, L.S., J.E. Suston, and P.N. Goodfellow. 1995. Sequence variation of the human Y chromosome. Nature 378: 379-380.
Tishkoff, S.A., E. Dietzsch, W. Speed, A.J. Pakstis, J.R. Kidd, K. Cheung, B. Bonn�-Tamir, A.S. Santachiara-Benerecetti, P. Moral, M. Krings, S. Paabo, E. Watson, N. Risch, T. Jenkins, and K.K. Kidd. 1996, Global patterns of linkage disequilibrium at the CD4 locus and modern human origins. Science 271: 1380-1387.
Fischman, J. 1996. Evidence mounts for our African origins - and alternatives. Science 271: 1364.
Klein, R.G. 1992. Evolutionary Anthropology 1: 5-14.
Simon, C. 1981. Stone-age sanctuary, oldest known shrine, discovered in Spain. Science News 120: 357.
Bower, B. 1986. When the human spirit soared. Science News 130: 378-379.
Krings, M., A. Stone, R. W. Schmitz, H. Krainitzki, M. Stoneking, and S. P��bo. 1997. Neandertal DNA Sequences and the Origin of Modern Humans. Cell 90: 19-30.
Morell, V. 1999. Ecology Returns to Speciation Studies. Science 284: 2106-2108.
Kerr, R.A. 1997. Climate-Evolution Link Weakens. Science 276: 1968.
Behrensmeyer, A.K., N.E. Todd, R. Potts, and G.E. McBrinn. 1997. Late Pliocene faunal turnover in the Turkana Basin, Kenya and Ethiopia. Science 278: 1589.
Klicka, J. and R.M. Zink. 1997. The importance of recent ice ages in speciation: a failed paradigm. Science 277: 1666-1669.
Orr, H.A. 1999. An Evolutionary Dead End? Science 285: 343-344.


Lisää löytyy tarvittaessa...

voe voe kirjoitti:

Felsenstein, J. 1981. J. Mol. Evol. 17: 368.
Goldman, N. 1993. J. Mol. Evol. 36:182.
Yang, Z., N. Goldman, and A. Friday. 1995. Mol. Biol. Evol. 11: 316.
Yang, Z. 1996. J. Mol. Evol. 42: 587.
Yang, Z. and D. Roberts. 1995. Mol. Biol. Evol. 12: 451.
Huelsenbeck, J.P., D.M. Hillis, and R. Nielsen. 1996. Syst. Biol. 45: 546.
Huelsenbeck, J.P. and J.J. Bull. 1996. Syst. Biol. 45: 92.
Huelsenbeck, J.P., B. Rannala, and Z. Yang. 1997. Evolution. 51:410.
Pennisi, E. 1999. Is It Time to Uproot the Tree of Life? Science 284: 1305-1307.
R.L. Cann, M. Stoneking, A.C. Wilson. 1987. Mitochondrial DNA and human evolution. Nature 325: 31.
L. Vigilant, M. Stoneking, A.C. Harpending, K. Hawkes, A.C. Wilson. 1991. African populations and the evolution of human mitochondrial DNA. Science 253: 1503.
M. Hasegawa, S. Horai. 1991. Time of the deepest root for polymorphism in human mitochondrial DNA. J. Mol. Evol. 32: 37.
Stoneking M, Sherry ST, Redd AJ, Vigilant L. 1992. New approaches to dating suggest a recent age for the human mtDNA ancestor. Philos. Trans. R. Soc. Lond. B Biol. Sci. 337: 167-175.
S. Paabo. 1995. The Y chromosome and the origin of all of us (men). Science 268: 1141.
R.L. Dorit, H. Akashi, W. Gilbert. 1995. Absence of polymorphism at the ZFY locus on the human Y chromosome. Science 268: 1183.
Hammer, M.F. 1995. A recent common ancestry for human Y chromosomes. Nature 378: 376-378.
Whitfield, L.S., J.E. Suston, and P.N. Goodfellow. 1995. Sequence variation of the human Y chromosome. Nature 378: 379-380.
Tishkoff, S.A., E. Dietzsch, W. Speed, A.J. Pakstis, J.R. Kidd, K. Cheung, B. Bonn�-Tamir, A.S. Santachiara-Benerecetti, P. Moral, M. Krings, S. Paabo, E. Watson, N. Risch, T. Jenkins, and K.K. Kidd. 1996, Global patterns of linkage disequilibrium at the CD4 locus and modern human origins. Science 271: 1380-1387.
Fischman, J. 1996. Evidence mounts for our African origins - and alternatives. Science 271: 1364.
Klein, R.G. 1992. Evolutionary Anthropology 1: 5-14.
Simon, C. 1981. Stone-age sanctuary, oldest known shrine, discovered in Spain. Science News 120: 357.
Bower, B. 1986. When the human spirit soared. Science News 130: 378-379.
Krings, M., A. Stone, R. W. Schmitz, H. Krainitzki, M. Stoneking, and S. P��bo. 1997. Neandertal DNA Sequences and the Origin of Modern Humans. Cell 90: 19-30.
Morell, V. 1999. Ecology Returns to Speciation Studies. Science 284: 2106-2108.
Kerr, R.A. 1997. Climate-Evolution Link Weakens. Science 276: 1968.
Behrensmeyer, A.K., N.E. Todd, R. Potts, and G.E. McBrinn. 1997. Late Pliocene faunal turnover in the Turkana Basin, Kenya and Ethiopia. Science 278: 1589.
Klicka, J. and R.M. Zink. 1997. The importance of recent ice ages in speciation: a failed paradigm. Science 277: 1666-1669.
Orr, H.A. 1999. An Evolutionary Dead End? Science 285: 343-344.


Lisää löytyy tarvittaessa...

Lue lisää

Ei kyllä kelpaa alkuunkaan, koska noita lähteitä on lainauslouhittu, vääristelty ja niistä on suoranaisesti valehdeltu. Kertoo jotain teidän "uskostanne', kun se ei pysy kasassa ilman epärehellisyyttä.

voe voe kirjoitti:

Felsenstein, J. 1981. J. Mol. Evol. 17: 368.
Goldman, N. 1993. J. Mol. Evol. 36:182.
Yang, Z., N. Goldman, and A. Friday. 1995. Mol. Biol. Evol. 11: 316.
Yang, Z. 1996. J. Mol. Evol. 42: 587.
Yang, Z. and D. Roberts. 1995. Mol. Biol. Evol. 12: 451.
Huelsenbeck, J.P., D.M. Hillis, and R. Nielsen. 1996. Syst. Biol. 45: 546.
Huelsenbeck, J.P. and J.J. Bull. 1996. Syst. Biol. 45: 92.
Huelsenbeck, J.P., B. Rannala, and Z. Yang. 1997. Evolution. 51:410.
Pennisi, E. 1999. Is It Time to Uproot the Tree of Life? Science 284: 1305-1307.
R.L. Cann, M. Stoneking, A.C. Wilson. 1987. Mitochondrial DNA and human evolution. Nature 325: 31.
L. Vigilant, M. Stoneking, A.C. Harpending, K. Hawkes, A.C. Wilson. 1991. African populations and the evolution of human mitochondrial DNA. Science 253: 1503.
M. Hasegawa, S. Horai. 1991. Time of the deepest root for polymorphism in human mitochondrial DNA. J. Mol. Evol. 32: 37.
Stoneking M, Sherry ST, Redd AJ, Vigilant L. 1992. New approaches to dating suggest a recent age for the human mtDNA ancestor. Philos. Trans. R. Soc. Lond. B Biol. Sci. 337: 167-175.
S. Paabo. 1995. The Y chromosome and the origin of all of us (men). Science 268: 1141.
R.L. Dorit, H. Akashi, W. Gilbert. 1995. Absence of polymorphism at the ZFY locus on the human Y chromosome. Science 268: 1183.
Hammer, M.F. 1995. A recent common ancestry for human Y chromosomes. Nature 378: 376-378.
Whitfield, L.S., J.E. Suston, and P.N. Goodfellow. 1995. Sequence variation of the human Y chromosome. Nature 378: 379-380.
Tishkoff, S.A., E. Dietzsch, W. Speed, A.J. Pakstis, J.R. Kidd, K. Cheung, B. Bonn�-Tamir, A.S. Santachiara-Benerecetti, P. Moral, M. Krings, S. Paabo, E. Watson, N. Risch, T. Jenkins, and K.K. Kidd. 1996, Global patterns of linkage disequilibrium at the CD4 locus and modern human origins. Science 271: 1380-1387.
Fischman, J. 1996. Evidence mounts for our African origins - and alternatives. Science 271: 1364.
Klein, R.G. 1992. Evolutionary Anthropology 1: 5-14.
Simon, C. 1981. Stone-age sanctuary, oldest known shrine, discovered in Spain. Science News 120: 357.
Bower, B. 1986. When the human spirit soared. Science News 130: 378-379.
Krings, M., A. Stone, R. W. Schmitz, H. Krainitzki, M. Stoneking, and S. P��bo. 1997. Neandertal DNA Sequences and the Origin of Modern Humans. Cell 90: 19-30.
Morell, V. 1999. Ecology Returns to Speciation Studies. Science 284: 2106-2108.
Kerr, R.A. 1997. Climate-Evolution Link Weakens. Science 276: 1968.
Behrensmeyer, A.K., N.E. Todd, R. Potts, and G.E. McBrinn. 1997. Late Pliocene faunal turnover in the Turkana Basin, Kenya and Ethiopia. Science 278: 1589.
Klicka, J. and R.M. Zink. 1997. The importance of recent ice ages in speciation: a failed paradigm. Science 277: 1666-1669.
Orr, H.A. 1999. An Evolutionary Dead End? Science 285: 343-344.


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Lue lisää

Otsikoista päätellen noissa aineistoissa keskustellaan enimmäkseen evoluution vauhdista; onko tahti tasainen vain tapahtuuko nopeampia pyrähdyksiä.

Jos mukana on yksikin, jossa "tieteellisesti osoitetaan makroevoluutio 100 % mahdottomaksi" kuten väitit, niin poimipa se esiin.

En usko, että poimit, tuskinpa enää vastaatkaan.

solon1 kirjoitti:

Ei kyllä kelpaa alkuunkaan, koska noita lähteitä on lainauslouhittu, vääristelty ja niistä on suoranaisesti valehdeltu. Kertoo jotain teidän "uskostanne', kun se ei pysy kasassa ilman epärehellisyyttä.

Lue lisää

Concession accepted, fagbo.

Tuttu sivusto. Tuo "tieteellinen" paperi ei ollut mitään muuta kuin lainauslouhintaa ja tietojen vääristelyä. Tässä se näkyy kreationistien epärehellisyys. Kun ei osata itse tehdä todellista tiedettä, niin "todisteita" sorvataan vääristelyllä ja irroittamalla lainauksia asiayhtyksistä.

"Opetelkaa perustelemaan väitteenne tieteellä"

Näin kehottaa Sepä Se, joka itse perustelee kommenttinsa raamatulla, hörhösivustojen hölmöilyllä ja kun tieteellisiä todisteita pyydetään Sepä Se vaikenee, väistää,kysymyksen ja liukenee paikalta.

Ironiaa.

Mielenkiintoista, syyttelet tiedettä siitä mihin kreatiosinmi suomessa perustuu, eli kiilaamiseen, johdatteluun kieroiluun ja valehteluun. kissakin muuttuu koiraksi kun oikein selittää...

Miten nuo edellämainitut viitteet liittyvät kreationismin todentaiseen?

Ja se että suvullisesti lisääntyvät eläimet muuttuvat hieman joka sukupolvessa, olemassaoleva materiaali muodostaa uuden kombinaation sekä joskus tapahtuu myös satunnainen mutaatio. Ja katso, kreationismin teesit kumottu. Lajit muuttuvat ilman ulkoista tekiää.

Arvon neidille tiedoksi, että tässä kuluneen vuoden aikana olen nähnyt palstalla tasan 0 (nolla) "tietoa", joka olisi ollut "kiusallista evokkimafialle".

Myötähäpeää tunsin alkuun puolestanne joitakin kertoja, mutta nykyään olen sitä hilpeämmällä tuulella mitä pahemmin munaatte itsenne, vaikka ette denialismissanne sitä itse tajuakaan.

RepeRuutikallo kirjoitti:

Arvon neidille tiedoksi, että tässä kuluneen vuoden aikana olen nähnyt palstalla tasan 0 (nolla) "tietoa", joka olisi ollut "kiusallista evokkimafialle".

Myötähäpeää tunsin alkuun puolestanne joitakin kertoja, mutta nykyään olen sitä hilpeämmällä tuulella mitä pahemmin munaatte itsenne, vaikka ette denialismissanne sitä itse tajuakaan.

Lue lisää

No kuulutko evokkimafiaankin kun vastailet heidänkin puolestaan?

Ilomielin poistatan palstalta asiattomia aloituksia ja muitakin asiattomia viestejä.
Jos kerrot mitä asiaa viestit koskivat, voin ehkä tietää, poistatinko minä ne.

voi ihme kuittaa tak kirjoitti:

No kuulutko evokkimafiaankin kun vastailet heidänkin puolestaan?

Kertoisitko lisää evokkimafiasta?